Litigation with waterboard over over billing and none payment

water, power, and internet should be free and uncensored the world over and i am sick of the greed

I never really stopped to think about a water bill till i got one which said 108 units, as i was always paying it by direct debit and never looked at the things. I even got one that was -5 as well. and when i stopped and thought about it. there was no way i was using that amount! in short i think their water meters are wrong! as they are trying to bill me 31 units a quarter when in reality i am perhaps using a third of that!. meaning i think they are billing me 3 litres for the price of one, and have been for years. actually its worse then that. as i reckon we could have only lost a unit (1000 litres max) though that overfill (based on on speed of hot tub fill at high pressure/strength it was pouring out/water on the ground if that!) which means its worse then that.

Conveniently i Had a hot tub (which was used years ago) before which so happens to hold one billing unit of water! it takes hours to fill with a house pipe at full pressure so its easy to see at a glance, how much water is in one unit of water. 1000 litres! to be precise. incidentally hot tubs when in use are filled up, about once eery 3 months. which was the water boards excuse for my high bills. which was ironic because i wasn't using it then! still aren't the pump is broke/needs repairing and is out of commission like my car.

I live alone! no dependents and have no money coming in. so i can't pay these rip off bills. and unlike gas, electricity the water board are a bunch of crooks when it comes to customer service. you think your getting through to someone who will help, and you get a lawyer on the end of the phone. trying to dismiss your issues and as i can't pay my bill. (£400+) with legals costs. they are taking me to court!

early correspondence from when i was still trying to get it resolved. this was after encountering the lawyers in customer service at the water board end:

Consumer council of water Response
response to official complaint from consumer council (page 1)
response to official complaint from consumer council (page 2)

note: these figures are showing figures from before they were charging me 45-15 units a quarter and my water usage hasn't changed, if anything i don't have the hot tub now and i did in those early figures. [that took about 1 unit once a quarter so didn't effect the bills much at all]

This is why i am putting this page together, to help others work out how much they are loosing to the water board.

Item Unit Used Frequency Notes
3 Seater Hot Tub: 1 Billing Unit (1000 litres aprox) filled once a quater when in use. this hasn't been used in years/doen't work currently  and was last in use when i was paying my bills. no money to run/no money to repair it or run it,  much like my car which has been grounded on the drive way with no petrol no mot, no insurance since jan while i work on this site.  *sigh*
servis caress 600 Washing Machine
(front loader and its always on the 40 degree wash cycle thing)
65? litres (random stat from a board - have no idea!) Once every 14 days This may end up being 2 loads every month (ought to keep track more) I don't seem to be changing that much these days (if ever) why change with no women about?/let it build up. so yeah this may look bad from certain perspectives and  i probably over fill it as well. sorry ladies!  perhaps i should have taken the fifth rather then saying trousers get warn for more then a week/underware more then a few days type of thing - but i don't think anyone washes as much as they claim to!)
WHY CANT I FIND AT A GLANCE WHAT THE WATER CAPCITY IS!!!!
Brushing teeth 0.2 - 1 litre max 1 a day fill a kettle to a litre. put it in a sink. compare how much water is in there. to when you run the tap. normally.  nope never did get in the habit of brushing in the morning at all
Washing up 12-15  litres once every 8 days cant afford to have hot water on. so it stays off! (that saved me £200 a quater turning thermostat off!) and i live alone so i let the dishes pile up. do a big wash when i run out of stuff, one assumes if ever i got back into dating again. this would change, then again that seems unlikely now> and yes i live off cheese sandwitches/black tea for the most part now
cooking (i.e. pasta! actually that's the only thing with me that needs additional water the rest is err cheese) 3 litres for a saucepan? perhaps swill one out/dirty knife every so often for a few secs perhaps once every 3-4 days with me perhaps i tend to live on cheese. so yeah. see food logs for more
Bath 160 litres? every other day (perhaps 1 in 4) my bath is 53cm at widest point. it curves on a bit. measuring it to the overflow. (without me in) it could hold 1.37 * 0.53 * 0.3 = 0.217 = 217 litres at the widest point.  i like deep baths, but i also like/have shallow ones. depending how hot the water is. some sources say a bath is 80 litres. i think this is perhaps an understatement.  160 perhaps. note my measurements are taken at the widest points! and bbc recorded 120 in their bath, with someone in. as i'm trying to find where my water goes
Loo flush 9 litres some days this is 0!
perhaps 7? x a day max (depending what i drink/if i go out) 0 to 45 units as is (needs an average talking)
tank measured 0.40cm x 0.17 x 0.14 = 9.5 litres (has stuff in it in theory it was installed in 96. so is a 7.5 litre one (new build) so yeah, how much does that tank take? and not all the water comes out so *meah* measured to the tide mark. older loos were supposedly 11 litre and the new duel ones are supposedly 4.5. which is why some say stick a house brick in. to reduce usage here!
I've also meditated for 36 hours straight before no food/drink/loo in periods like that and even slept through day or gone its not worth getting up/i need a plan - too late now as still i haven't found one at all (and if anything saves money/food/water looking at these bills!)
cant find a house brick - try a hippo insteafd
cups of tea!
(400ml in a large mug)
4 litres a day max,0 min.  avg 4.9 cups over 49 weeks = 1.96 litres meditation/sleep can  go a day without drinking at all! now from my food logs i have brought 21 boxs of tesco value 80 tea bag in a 49 week period. and given i sort of buy similar time. that means i'm drinking 4.9 cups of tea on average a day! obviously when i'm going out standing in the street advertising this goes down (do the entire day on a bottle of coke! kingsgate or something else) and well if i'm coding/avoiding coding i will drink more depending on if i'm in the zone or not!
other things
leaking taps?  (bathroom/dont always turn off right)  0 to 4 litre a day max put plug in sink, measure how much water is lost in 24 period!
the taps in my bathroom are certainly dodgy and i would replace them, but i don'thave the tools/know how/cant afford a plumber but even so. this isn't where the waters going at all. however i have tighten taps and before (and i was paranoid about this) and thats when my water bill dropped. this may be coinciece but i think their systems are picking up movement when their is none?  (dont distinguish pressure at all - that or they are a bunch of crooks!) they seemed to be working find, started writing this and im woundering if i'm subconciously trying to leave them on. get a better idea.
but yeah 4 litres max if i haven't tightened them properly more like 600ml over 4 hour period/tightened them up. water was running down the one tap. i.e. could see it visible. and its  not usually like that at all. so i may be trying to mimic worse case here/dig a hole
fish tank! got rid of it years ago got rid of it years ago.  4ft by 1.5 ft x 3ft  -in theory your supposed to top it up/do water changes every so often, but yeah i forget what this is in practice. back when i had bills of 7 a quatar!
plants? 200 ml a week perhaps one plant in the bathroom - it died (not watered regular) one your not suppose to be able to kill as i kept forgetting to feed it but it lasted a few years
one offs
leakage from overflow which results in 108 unit bill after i used the other toilet (rare occu)rrence and the cistern didn't close. i.e. the ball in the float/partially close so water started coming out of the overflow in the wall! this was spotted by neighbours who reported it to me, i fixed immediately. Then they sent me a bill for 108 which kind of magnified what came out. so its amost lke your getting penalised for duration rather then partial usage at all. plus any water which did come out, was the side of the house, not through their pipes! as they try and bill you for that. assuming anything going in, is coming out as well! i used the other toilet (not used in years - spare room) and for some reason. the handle didn't go down. and it caried on filling. this resulted in it hitting the overflow. water leaking out the side of the house. neighbour called me. to tell me it was leaking. it was leaking for less then 24 hours! i traced it to the loo. and rectified it. (ie the bong bit in the cistern hadn't come up)

Now given the short amount of time it was leaking, and the speed of the flow. i.e. how quick it was coming out. i know it was impossible to loose that amount of water. i.e. my hot tub is one billing unit! and i know how long that takes to fill on high pressure. which is my proof the meter system is wrong!

frankly they ignored whati had to say/used it as an excuse to go into me as its "Impossible for the meters to be wrong" and basically just went legal on my ass/cutting me off on the phone saying its my fault not listening to maths at all. as they quoted  flow rates from main line, and not what people use in their home.

which makes me wounder how many others are being done. i also raised this  with the watch dog and while i got a mail//letter in the post i don't think it makes a difference generally as  - its the water board and how dare you question them! (make me wounder why they need so many lawyers in customer service mind/so hard line when people are raising issues mind?)

notwithstanding the psychic side/the anitchrist thing and those issues life throws at you to make you learn certain things/do them. their system is a joke, I can't pay the bill/its ripping people off and their systems are wrong so i refuse to pay it on principle now! if they billed me what i was actually using - i could have perhaps kept it up, but they were demanding what i didn't have. so i defaulted on this debt, as wel as mortgages, credit cards and other things. as i am basically paying for any service which keeps me in business, allows me to expand my site [www.thesetree.co.uk] so i can bring money in again

people won't hire psychics! inter alia bon sur [almost like trying to get branson to hire suger as an employee! you don't do it as its a threat to your business in the end, as i would under cut them/take them out if i had the chance/duplicate it. as i'm sick of  working like a slave making everyone else rich, which is why i devoted my life to my own site. as i try and compete against the americans/silican valley things like that]

this is me making excuses now as I have 0 money coming in, all my saving are in thesextree and thats my job, until that starts paying off 0 i am unable to humour people like this! hence my stance. and if anything my numbers are  worst case for me/in their favour, as i really am trying to get my bill to add up to them! which is insane! as i'm living alone not using water at all compared to some people/famiies i know 
water boards generaly testify to giving people the benefit of the doubt underbilling as far as water meters go. i.e. supposedly they set them to pick up less! but its clearly not happening here

so yeah the water board claim in the last 3 months i used 31 * 1000 litres = 31,000 litres of water. which  for the period of 17/8/09 to 16/11/2009  would  equate to (31 + 30 + 31 days = 92 days) = 336.95 litres  average a day as claimed by the water board and some of my bills have been around the 40+ mark for a similar usage pattern, as i've not done anything different here at all and i remember when i was getting bills (after looking back at old records for 7 units ironically in periods when my hot tub was on (sigh) this was back when the water bill was small/none issue and you ignored it as it was only water! my usage hasn't changed! i still take the same amount of baths i always did. the only thing i can be doing is using the look more/making more tea. and i'm not even filling the hot tub now!

Daily usage
Item worst case usage Best case usage
Loo Flush!
washing hands?
leaking taps
washing up
washing machine
hot tub (if in use 11 per fill not in use)
teeth
bath
Drinks (tea)
cooking (pasta)
plants
total:164.2880.51
Billing Units (1000 litres) quatar:14.997.35
legal stuff coming soon
as it stands if your taken to the small claims court. you will have a form with a date of issue on. 5 days after this is the date of service (you might get it before) and you have 14 days from that (5 + 14) to get a notice of service in. this can be done online, only takes a moment. and you will have a password/url/claim number on the form which comes out to you. you then have another 14 days to get a defence in, and that is where we are currently. more coming soon - when we get it here asi have to file by the 14th december 2009 for that!

please note the wording if the charge is

"charges fixed pursuant to the Water industry act 1991 in respect of hereditament(s) situate at :- [copy of the address] for the period end [copy of date] "

Amount Claimed: £336.65
Court Fee: £30
Solicitor Costs £50

we contest the jurisdiction of this court [theres a tick box on the form] for inter alia that other ongoing issue regarding article 15, 17 of the united nations declaration of rights. i.e. we declared independance/formation of a seperate state. no long recognise British law at all.
receipt from the online filing system for contesting juristiction 27/11/2010
all quite over the christmas period (as we are pressured with calls from other creditors and stuff like suicide attempts) strictly that came after the expiry of the other deadline. no cash for postage. and well theirs still the ongoing tax war failure to pay mortgages, and well having no support from britian at all - but i won't ham it up. as we don't have the time to spend anything here. and well we no longer recognise british law! so they can fuck off, if i'm going to waste my time trying to explain it to them, after my other experiences in court. especially as all other threats for court action list that court as well! which is too suspicious for my tastes. so i am left wondering the merits of contesting it in a court i can get to instead!
22nd response - judgement entered against us - for not filing a response 19/1/2010
25th jan - letter sent out by one of the sharks.
Feb 1st another company (better letter then the first one) but again not suitable here
Waterboard Demand Dated 29 jan (recieved 4th)
new legal action threat dated 18th march 2010

Note:we've had letter/spoken to finance people before. they tend to threaten you with jail, and play on your fears for cash. and well its not applicable as i have 0 income coming in so couldn't pay anything if i tried! as we're trying to make the remains of an overdraft stretch to cover a new tenant, and it doesn't cover gas safety certificates/enviromental efficiency reports and the estate agents fees currently. either! anyway we gave up speaking to finance advisors ages ago. as their advice was amaturish/sucked and reminded me of the times i worked in the banks with their mortgage systems. plus it wouldn't take into account the other issues like us having declared independence citing article 15, 17/formation of a separate state and am going it alone, as one against many - till death do us part. in full realisation that it will most probably lead to my eventual death/execution or a blood bath. as the rivers run red in British blood, which is most probably the only set of events which will happen now! given time. as my mind crossed the threshold, and there's no going back. once you hit that point. and words, rhetoric changes nothing now. (i got sick of people going into me for being a satanist/discriminated again when i started thesextree - which also has nothing to do with this and well i gave up after visting the royal courts of justive/had the responses from teh court of appeal as i just looked at the words, how the system worked, and went enough is enough and i'm not doing this anymore. as any time spent in legal action, detracts from business and well i'd rather spend the time pushing/adding to my site. as thats the only thing which will save me now! obviously if i f**k up - i die. but i see britian as an enemy now!


threats for warrants of execution for beliefs tend to make me vow never to pay anything, and consider alternative plans like how to co-ordinate retaliatry attacks against british solil (see palestine for more) as those bills were wrong, and i will not pay for that water i didn't use. and no court on planet earth is going to tell me otherwise as i've had enough now, and am trying to run a business here. water board played hardball with me on the phone from day one, saying it was impossible for meters to be wrong and well i don't respond well to threats at all. which is how things esculate out of control (see the british civil war - ship money for more) as i've developed a siege mentality here, and any ultra vires breach will result in death. i no longer recognise british law and am dealing with this as per the rules of war/international law.

humpty dumpty sat on a wall, humpty dumpty had a great fall and all the parties of parliament couldn't put humpty together again... see palastine/israel for more. the antichrist out. nothing to do with water, but that other stuff instead. i.e. illegaly detaining witches for the belief set inter alia

hard to say  what happens now.  as we no longer recognise British law, and well we have no intent - or ability to pay- or inclination to respond to this now. i.e. couldn't pay even if we wanted to. and well with the escalation of the council tax stuff, and other things. we will not respond to British law (which we consinder ultra vires) as we don't reocognise anyone right to duress. and well we are going to defend the land accordingly. anyway the water bill was wrong, and our minds kind of set on sticking too fingers up at britian, and well trying to last for as long as we have money for food/get taken out by snipers which is perhaps not taking charge at all
ergo we are left responding to events, going with the flow, considering our next move which is perhaps the wrong thing to do. as we perhaps should take action to correct it! as the flow is wrong, and there is no f**king way i'm paying that bill. even if i had the money (which i don't) which is another issue.

other people may want to consider other defences like proper billing. (and we shouldn't have to pay anything) until we get one. but the odds of britian actually listening/recognising water meteres as wrong. is perhaps a joke, given the current political climate, so yeah your on your own. (seek a layer or some other defence) €

other useful laws to know
article 25 - standard of living (decleration of rights)
article 15 European charter - freedom to choose an occupation
article 16 European charter right to conduct a business
article 34 - European charter and social assistance
your rights with baliffs
never let anyone in for any reason ever
yes i'm still anoyed for the illegal break in, from when i was a witch (doing psychic development) and lack of compensation there of and any use of force by any government/organisation will be met with force in kind! as i don't care if this spills out into another civil war as none of you have any respect for anyone at all and i would also consider the merits if you do own property of setting it up in trust- and managing it in respect for someone who benefits from it at a later date. say your death or something like that. as companies,trusts are seperate legal entites inter alia as well to you the individual though that perhaps not helps here and your perhaps advised to consider your own legal advice

 

i also had a 4ft fish tak back then (5 years back)! which had water in, don't even have that now. and my bills have been astronomical since. going even further back. i actually lived with someone but you kind of do things like sharing baths/having showers  but even that was lower then it is now

other suggstions: you have a leak mate? no i dont as mybills go down as well as up! a leak would go up! and coninue to go up/worse as the leak gets worse. this is a random number generator. (only  its perhaps more logical then that) they over bill you/hope no one notices perhaps?

 

please remember i am in recepit no benefit at all and have never recieved benefit in my life
council tax appeal page

Rapidly coming to the conclusion that all water, electricity, broadband and housing should be free and people should make a pledge to provide it for everyone in the world - as its the 21st century and its becoming a joke. unfortauntly that probably invovles the business model/view point in the west to change and puts the emphasis on self sufficeny/teaching people the skills how to build things at home/doing it on a charity basis. i.e. villages/towns put stuff in place because they want to - rather then the god kingdom approach of trying to install mamoth dictatorships which treat the people as slaves. [sorry the satanic witch in me, can't resist going into them at all, for censorship/stupidity inter alia (its a character flaw i guess)*] as they ignore their views/trample all over them because they are small. Their appears to be other options out there but the people seem to have stopped thinking/assume it costs alot and trying to scare everyone into big business (with no power at home) in the meantime the little person (the ones without a voice) get screwed. oooooooooops obviously i'm the wrong religion to do anything here. as the only power i have, is to demand a bill which is fair!

* some clairvoyance keeps having me come back to this, as "theres not much in it now" was one comment/so its turning into a game/stuborness here. with the same soutions from different stand points/arguments. i.e. the satanic witch one is knowlege, individuals having power. doing it on the small scale v the slavery/censorship/stupidity one. but that kind of discounts certain enterprises which go in/help people out/make them self sufficent which seems more a satanic thing to do, then a christian thing (god just wanted to take over) not that i'm trying to hyjack sharing of knowlege/the apple and all. we did it first/they surpressed it and yes how many witches were burnt again? as they round people up/put them in concetration camps again, but thats another issue entirely (i think) as well the people are stupid as a mob/under the leadership of "authority" - i guess, and corporations listen to no one at all... so yes guess we're screwed here, as one against many again. anyway as we find out more, we will put it up. so others can learn from our mistakes/save time make a better life of it type of thing.

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